XC2000

Hello, I would like to ask, if there is any downloadable software to implement designs on XC2000 family devices? I know the XACT 5.1.2 is the latest software that support XC2000, and is there any way to obtain a free copy of this software or any other old DOS software that can implement designs for XC2000 devices?

Do not start a new design with XC2000 products. They are of pre-1990
vintage.
My rule is: One year in FPGA evolution equals 15 years in human aging.
So these parts correspond to a 15 x 15 = 225 year old
great-grandfather. Do not disturb him in his grave.
Newer chips are so much easier to design with, and Spartan 3 devices
are ridiculously cheap.
Don't waste any new-design effort on FPGAs that were introduced at any
time in the previous century. Some people may have no choice when they
need to fix old designs, but nobody should do this voluntarily. Just
aim for the nearest trash can...
Peter Alfke, Xilinx Applications

Actually, he might be in the same boat as me.  Some of us need to maintain 
hardware and software developed 15-20 years ago.  And this means FPGA 
development as well.

For this, I need to keep an old.... real old... PC around just to maintain 
my XC3090 stuff.

-- Ed



"Peter Alfke" <peter@xilinx.com> wrote in message 
news:1132790004.827979.224250@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> Do not start a new design with XC2000 products. They are of pre-1990
> vintage.
> My rule is: One year in FPGA evolution equals 15 years in human aging.
> So these parts correspond to a 15 x 15 = 225 year old
> great-grandfather. Do not disturb him in his grave.
> Newer chips are so much easier to design with, and Spartan 3 devices
> are ridiculously cheap.
> Don't waste any new-design effort on FPGAs that were introduced at any
> time in the previous century. Some people may have no choice when they
> need to fix old designs, but nobody should do this voluntarily. Just
> aim for the nearest trash can...
> Peter Alfke, Xilinx Applications
> 

There is a dichotomy between the extreme reliability and longevity of
the electronic hardware, and its rapid obsolescence. The equipment does
not die, but it gets harder and harder to maintain, let alone upgrade
it. The military suffers most from this, but industrial and medical may
not be so far behind. Long ago, even telecom moved slowly, but that has
changed dramatically during the past decades.

Certain chips seem to stay around forever, like the 8051 and the Z80 (I
was Zilog Applications in 1978/9), but I don't think you can find a
'286 or even a '386 today. Xilinx still offers some XC3000A chips (I
think), but the software and the computer operating system are a
different matter.

My warning was just that nobody should venture into this archaeological
trap without a very compelling reason.
Peter Alfke, from home.

There is a dichotomy between the extreme reliability and longevity of
the electronic hardware, and its rapid obsolescence. The equipment does
not die, but it gets harder and harder to maintain, let alone upgrade
it. The military suffers most from this, but industrial and medical may
not be so far behind. Long ago, even telecom moved slowly, but that has
changed dramatically during the past decades.

Certain chips seem to stay around forever, like the 8051 and the Z80 (I
was Zilog Applications in 1978/9), but I don't think you can find a
'286 or even a '386 today. Xilinx still offers some XC3000A chips (I
think), but the software and the computer operating system are a
different matter.

My warning was just that nobody should venture into this archaeological
trap without a very compelling reason.
Peter Alfke, from home.

Yes, I had a reason for using XC2000 device. I'm from Poland and here there is no way to buy any of Xilinx FPGA device, even if I found in some Internet shop in Poland FPGA, it is too expensive. Buying FPGA in shop in foreign countries where FPGA are chip, price of shipping to Poland is also too high. I have two XC2064 and I want use it to build FIFO dedicated driver for SRAMs memory. I know that it could be builded in this device because I have old PC/104 single board computer which has FIFO driver in XC2064.

If there is no way to get old XACT software, I probably buy CPLD from Atmel because its price is very less than Xilinx CPLD (in Poland). But on the other hand the software from Atmel for his CPLD is realy poor (in front of Xilinx Webpack). Meybe I design my device in webpack and then convert it to the atmel device. This will be probably the most economical solution for me.

Please explain what makes Poland so expensive. (I have spent some time
there). The Iron Curtain is long gone. PL is part of the EU, postal
rates from the US are reasonable. It is not a rich country, but people
are not poor. Why would you spend days (weeks?) of chasing obsolete
software and an old computer to program your tiny and slow part, when
you can avoid all that by using the smallest and cheapst modern FPGA,
like a Spartan3 device. You seem to believe that you have a reason...
Peter Alfke

"Peter Alfke" <alfke@sbcglobal.net> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:1132853331.047793.240650@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> Please explain what makes Poland so expensive. (I have spent some time
> there). The Iron Curtain is long gone. PL is part of the EU, postal
> rates from the US are reasonable. It is not a rich country, but people
> are not poor. Why would you spend days (weeks?) of chasing obsolete
> software and an old computer to program your tiny and slow part, when
> you can avoid all that by using the smallest and cheapst modern FPGA,
> like a Spartan3 device. You seem to believe that you have a reason...
> Peter Alfke
>

Hi Peter,

you did beat me in response :)
I was actually offering to send some Spartan-2 chips that are somewhere on
my desk to the original poster.

There are different sales channels, and the overhead they may charge may
differ greatly, so I can easily belive that buying qty 1 Xilinx FPGA from
Poland is not possible without paying for the shipment more than the silicon
does cost.

to the OP, the offer is still valid, please ask in private email if you are
interested. I defenetly have some spartan-2 in TQ144 overleft

Antti

S3E development board, how low can it go?
http://xilant.com/content/view/15/51/

Antti Lukats wrote:
> S3E development board, how low can it go?
> http://xilant.com/content/view/15/51/

  Interesting, - but isn't 28 pins a little light - just 16 FPGA I/O ?
perhaps double rows, would keep a similar form factor, backward 
compatible to DIP28, but allow 0.1" expansion to 56 pins ?

No mention of the size/speed of the dataflash ?

re Lattice "newsflash"on link above - hmmm, reads like classic 
competitor FUD.

  OK, their balance sheets are not stellar, but are fairly typical for 
an average semi company.
  Their sales trends indicate to me that their older parts
are tailing off faster than the new parts ramp up, but that is
temporary. Assets look strong, and they are pumping money
into Fujitsu for long term FAB edge.

  All up, I'd take such FUD as signs the competitor is seriously
worried by what they can see comming ! :)

  Altera must be miffed by Lattice, who have trumped their MAX II,
with the better MachXO, AND also have Zero Power CPLDs, so have
Altera's old technology CPLD market in a pincer movement.

  What are Xilinx planning in CPLDs ?

-jg

"Jim Granville" <no.spam@designtools.co.nz> schrieb im Newsbeitrag 
news:43862d44$1@clear.net.nz...
> Antti Lukats wrote:
>> S3E development board, how low can it go?
>> http://xilant.com/content/view/15/51/
>
>  Interesting, - but isn't 28 pins a little light - just 16 FPGA I/O ?
> perhaps double rows, would keep a similar form factor, backward compatible 
> to DIP28, but allow 0.1" expansion to 56 pins ?
>
> No mention of the size/speed of the dataflash ?
>
> re Lattice "newsflash"on link above - hmmm, reads like classic competitor 
> FUD.
>
>  OK, their balance sheets are not stellar, but are fairly typical for an 
> average semi company.
>  Their sales trends indicate to me that their older parts
> are tailing off faster than the new parts ramp up, but that is
> temporary. Assets look strong, and they are pumping money
> into Fujitsu for long term FAB edge.
>
>  All up, I'd take such FUD as signs the competitor is seriously
> worried by what they can see comming ! :)
>
>  Altera must be miffed by Lattice, who have trumped their MAX II,
> with the better MachXO, AND also have Zero Power CPLDs, so have
> Altera's old technology CPLD market in a pincer movement.
>
>  What are Xilinx planning in CPLDs ?
>
> -jg
>
Hi Jim,

there is actually a pin desnsity upgrade available in the same form factor, 
but reatining compatibility with single density, so board standard goes to 
some 96 ios

BTW the competitor gossip was not from Altera ;)

and I personally really think that the MachXO is way better than MAX2 and 
tha new Lattice low cost/flash FPGAs are nice too. But Lattice has also tons 
of old too expensive chips that nobody really wants I guess, and at the time 
they are working towards 90nm and 65nm FPGAs the profit lass could be 
temporary - interesting times in any case

Antti