Is this a good starter kit?

This Digilent combo package looks to me like an excellent way to learn
FPGAs (but then, I don't know anything yet!):

http://www.digilentinc.com/Catalog/digilab_2_dio2.html

Do more experienced eyes see any gotchas with this setup?  I realize
the FPGA is bigger than a beginner needs, but the price seems good,
and I gather the part is from a mainstream FPGA family.

Thanks.

Looks good to me. I am actually not sure if this level of complexity (number
of peripherals) is required for learning, perhaps you could find something
cheaper with less peripherals. With this kit you could design a small
microprocessor, but you would probaly have to add some external memory
(through the provided expansion ports) to make any practical use of it...

/Mikhail


"Mike Silva" <snarflemike@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:20619edc.0311171148.4b9d44f5@posting.google.com...
> This Digilent combo package looks to me like an excellent way to learn
> FPGAs (but then, I don't know anything yet!):
>
> http://www.digilentinc.com/Catalog/digilab_2_dio2.html
>
> Do more experienced eyes see any gotchas with this setup?  I realize
> the FPGA is bigger than a beginner needs, but the price seems good,
> and I gather the part is from a mainstream FPGA family.
>
> Thanks.

In article <20619edc.0311171148.4b9d44f5@posting.google.com>,
Mike Silva <snarflemike@yahoo.com> wrote:
>This Digilent combo package looks to me like an excellent way to learn
>FPGAs (but then, I don't know anything yet!):
>
>http://www.digilentinc.com/Catalog/digilab_2_dio2.html
>
>Do more experienced eyes see any gotchas with this setup?

No external RAM is the biggie; I'd much rather have RAM and USB than
fifteen push-button switches and a 2x40 LCD display.

Tom

"Mike Silva" <snarflemike@yahoo.com> wrote in message =
news:20619edc.0311171148.4b9d44f5@posting.google.com...
> This Digilent combo package looks to me like an excellent way to learn
> FPGAs (but then, I don't know anything yet!):
>=20
> http://www.digilentinc.com/Catalog/digilab_2_dio2.html
>=20
> Do more experienced eyes see any gotchas with this setup?  I realize
> the FPGA is bigger than a beginner needs, but the price seems good,
> and I gather the part is from a mainstream FPGA family.
>=20
> Thanks.

I got myself a similar combo but with the dio1
and a couple of the breadboards
http://www.digilentinc.com/Catalog/digilab__io1.html
http://www.digilentinc.com/Catalog/digilab_breadboard___wire-wrap.html
the lack of memory is a bit annoying sometimes

Have you had a look at http://www.burched.biz/
http://www.burched.biz/b5xsvp.html


Alex

"Alex Gibson" <alxx/*nospam*/@@/*nospam*/ihug./*nospam*/com./remove/au> wrote in message news:<bphg4m$dlu$1@lust.ihug.co.nz>...
> "Mike Silva" <snarflemike@yahoo.com> wrote in message 
> news:20619edc.0311171148.4b9d44f5@posting.google.com...
> > This Digilent combo package looks to me like an excellent way to learn
> > FPGAs (but then, I don't know anything yet!):
> > 
> > http://www.digilentinc.com/Catalog/digilab 2 dio2.html
> > 
> > Do more experienced eyes see any gotchas with this setup?  I realize
> > the FPGA is bigger than a beginner needs, but the price seems good,
> > and I gather the part is from a mainstream FPGA family.
> > 
> > Thanks.
> 
> I got myself a similar combo but with the dio1
> and a couple of the breadboards
> http://www.digilentinc.com/Catalog/digilab  io1.html
> http://www.digilentinc.com/Catalog/digilab breadboard   wire-wrap.html
> the lack of memory is a bit annoying sometimes
> 
> Have you had a look at http://www.burched.biz/
> http://www.burched.biz/b5xsvp.html

Well, there's clear consensus that I'll be wanting RAM!  I did look at
the burched.biz stuff, but the 2.5X price put me off.

Seems like it should be easy enough to cobble up some RAM on one of
the digilent proto boards, yes?

> Well, there's clear consensus that I'll be wanting RAM!  I did look at
> the burched.biz stuff, but the 2.5X price put me off.

I don't know whether it is a consensus. It all depends on what you are going
to be working on... If your goal is to design a microprocessor and port
linux on it then you clearly need some RAM. On the other hand if you want to
do a black jack game or a traffic light controller you won't need any RAM.

> Seems like it should be easy enough to cobble up some RAM on one of
> the digilent proto boards, yes?

You will need to build a little board with a proper connector. This will
probably cost you at least as much as the difference in the prices between
the boards you looked at... Have you checked with Digilent? They might be
offering expansion boards...

/Mikhail

"MM" <mbmsv@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<bplpmb$1pjjup$1@ID-204311.news.uni-berlin.de>...
> > Well, there's clear consensus that I'll be wanting RAM!  I did look at
> > the burched.biz stuff, but the 2.5X price put me off.
> 
> I don't know whether it is a consensus. It all depends on what you are going
> to be working on... If your goal is to design a microprocessor and port
> linux on it then you clearly need some RAM. On the other hand if you want to
> do a black jack game or a traffic light controller you won't need any RAM.

Just looking for a system to learn about FPGAs in my spare time.  In
all honesty I probably will never use more than a few percent of the
device.  Plenty of blinking lights is clearly the most important
feature. :)
> 
> > Seems like it should be easy enough to cobble up some RAM on one of
> > the digilent proto boards, yes?
> 
> You will need to build a little board with a proper connector. This will
> probably cost you at least as much as the difference in the prices between
> the boards you looked at... Have you checked with Digilent? They might be
> offering expansion boards...

Well, I can buy a couple of 128Kx8 SRAMs for 12 bucks, and another $12
for a proto board that's designed to plug into the FPGA board.  For a
little effort I still save $250.

I also notice that the Spartan device comes with 56k bits of block
RAM.  I gather that I could use that for small RAM needs.

Mike,

> Just looking for a system to learn about FPGAs in my spare time.  In
> all honesty I probably will never use more than a few percent of the
> device.  Plenty of blinking lights is clearly the most important
> feature. :)

Well, then it sounds like this board has all that you will need...

> > You will need to build a little board with a proper connector. This will
> > probably cost you at least as much as the difference in the prices
between
> > the boards you looked at... Have you checked with Digilent? They might
be
> > offering expansion boards...
>
> Well, I can buy a couple of 128Kx8 SRAMs for 12 bucks, and another $12
> for a proto board that's designed to plug into the FPGA board.  For a
> little effort I still save $250.

The problem with this approach is signal integrity.... It will work in
principle but it might not work at the board's full speed (at whatever the
clock rate is there). However, it doesn't sound as you will need extra RAM
anytime soon anyway...

> I also notice that the Spartan device comes with 56k bits of block
> RAM.  I gather that I could use that for small RAM needs.

Yes, sure! That's what it is there for!


/Mikhail

In article <20619edc.0311211127.77c8c0a@posting.google.com>,
Mike Silva <snarflemike@yahoo.com> wrote:
>"Alex Gibson" <alxx/*nospam*/@@/*nospam*/ihug./*nospam*/com./remove/au> wrote in message news:<bphg4m$dlu$1@lust.ihug.co.nz>...
>> I got myself a similar combo but with the dio1
>> and a couple of the breadboards
>> http://www.digilentinc.com/Catalog/digilab  io1.html
>> http://www.digilentinc.com/Catalog/digilab breadboard   wire-wrap.html
>> the lack of memory is a bit annoying sometimes
>> 
>> Have you had a look at http://www.burched.biz/
>> http://www.burched.biz/b5xsvp.html
>
>Well, there's clear consensus that I'll be wanting RAM!  I did look at
>the burched.biz stuff, but the 2.5X price put me off.

xess.com has a board for the same price as the digilab, with RAM,
though the FPGA is a good deal smaller and you'd have to use
prototyping board for the blinkylights.  I'd have thought that
building interfaces to blinkylights and push-buttons was easier than
building interfaces to RAM (no need to worry about signal integrity
...) but I've built neither.

Tom

snarflemike@yahoo.com (Mike Silva) wrote in message news:<20619edc.0311171148.4b9d44f5@posting.google.com>...
> This Digilent combo package looks to me like an excellent way to learn
> FPGAs (but then, I don't know anything yet!):
> 
> http://www.digilentinc.com/Catalog/digilab_2_dio2.html
> 
> Do more experienced eyes see any gotchas with this setup?  I realize
> the FPGA is bigger than a beginner needs, but the price seems good,
> and I gather the part is from a mainstream FPGA family.
> 
> Thanks.

This is the same setup I started with. I started with smaller projects
but after about 3 or 4 months of working my way up I was able to get
an openrisc processor running with uclinux. I did have to design my
own little DRAM board for this.
Still there is more than enough onboard memory to run an 8bit or 32
bit cpu and do some basic testing.
If you order this board be sure to ask for the  300k Spartan II rather
than the 200k. The extra 100k gates only costs about $10 more. When I
had the full openrisc up and running with uclinux I used 94% of the
300k Spartan.