I got a batch of "Xilinx" Spartan XCS30 FPGAs from a Chinese seller, and am having problems with random failures at first power up. Sometimes it is a stuck I/O pin, sometimes a failure to configure. I first thought maybe we had an ESD problem, but I'm now thinking these may be counterfeit. They have white ink printed labels on the front, whereas other Xilinx chips have laser-etched labels. Also, these Spartan chips don't have the Spartan logo just below the Xilinx logo, like my other Xilinx chips. Anyone have any comments on this? Jon
counterfeit Xilinx ?
Started by ●March 23, 2008
Reply by ●March 23, 20082008-03-23
"Jon Elson" <elson@pico-systems.com> wrote in message news:hfqdnVk6trG-d3vanZ2dnUVZ_ournZ2d@giganews.com...>I got a batch of "Xilinx" Spartan XCS30 FPGAs from a Chinese > seller, and am having problems with random failures at first power up. > Sometimes it is a stuck I/O pin, sometimes a failure to configure. I > first thought maybe we had an ESD problem, but I'm now thinking these may > be counterfeit. They have white ink printed labels on the front, whereas > other Xilinx chips have laser-etched labels. Also, these Spartan chips > don't have the Spartan logo just below the Xilinx logo, like my other > Xilinx chips. Anyone have any comments on this? > > JonSurely you've sent one in to Xilinx for their appraisal. What did they say? Bob
Reply by ●March 24, 20082008-03-24
Jon Elson wrote:> I got a batch of "Xilinx" Spartan XCS30 FPGAs from a Chinese > seller, and am having problems with random failures at first > power up. Sometimes it is a stuck I/O pin, sometimes a failure > to configure. I first thought maybe we had an ESD problem, but > I'm now thinking these may be counterfeit. They have white ink > printed labels on the front, whereas other Xilinx chips have > laser-etched labels. Also, these Spartan chips don't have the > Spartan logo just below the Xilinx logo, like my other Xilinx > chips. Anyone have any comments on this? > > JonUnlikely to be "counterfeit" in the true sense, but I understand Asia has long had a problem with 'grey market' devices. Stories of truckloads on Intel Pentiums going into one alley in Hong Kong, and truckloads of higher spec'd devices coming out an adjacent alley abound :) With Silicon, there are also the post-package rejects to consider. What happens to them ? (XIlinx actually sell some as Easy Path- could these be Easy path devices, re-labeled ?) -jg
Reply by ●March 24, 20082008-03-24
Jon Elson <elson@pico-systems.com> wrote:>I got a batch of "Xilinx" Spartan XCS30 FPGAs from a Chinese >seller, and am having problems with random failures at first >power up. Sometimes it is a stuck I/O pin, sometimes a failure >to configure. I first thought maybe we had an ESD problem, but >I'm now thinking these may be counterfeit. They have white ink >printed labels on the front, whereas other Xilinx chips have >laser-etched labels. Also, these Spartan chips don't have the >Spartan logo just below the Xilinx logo, like my other Xilinx >chips. Anyone have any comments on this?Photo.. ?
Reply by ●March 24, 20082008-03-24
sky465nm@trline4.org wrote:> Jon Elson <elson@pico-systems.com> wrote: > >>I got a batch of "Xilinx" Spartan XCS30 FPGAs from a Chinese >>seller, and am having problems with random failures at first >>power up. Sometimes it is a stuck I/O pin, sometimes a failure >>to configure. I first thought maybe we had an ESD problem, but >>I'm now thinking these may be counterfeit. They have white ink >>printed labels on the front, whereas other Xilinx chips have >>laser-etched labels. Also, these Spartan chips don't have the >>Spartan logo just below the Xilinx logo, like my other Xilinx >>chips. Anyone have any comments on this? > > > Photo.. ? >OK, where should I put the photos? Jon
Reply by ●March 24, 20082008-03-24
"Jon Elson" <elson@wustl.edu> wrote in message news:47E7F9C4.7060001@wustl.edu...> > > sky465nm@trline4.org wrote: >> Jon Elson <elson@pico-systems.com> wrote: >> >>>I got a batch of "Xilinx" Spartan XCS30 FPGAs from a Chinese >>>seller, and am having problems with random failures at first power up. >>>Sometimes it is a stuck I/O pin, sometimes a failure to configure. I >>>first thought maybe we had an ESD problem, but I'm now thinking these may >>>be counterfeit. They have white ink printed labels on the front, whereas >>>other Xilinx chips have laser-etched labels. Also, these Spartan chips >>>don't have the Spartan logo just below the Xilinx logo, like my other >>>Xilinx chips. Anyone have any comments on this? >> >> >> Photo.. ? >> > OK, where should I put the photos? > > JonI'm not touching that one... Bob>
Reply by ●March 24, 20082008-03-24
On Mar 24, 11:58=A0am, Jon Elson <el...@wustl.edu> wrote:> sky46...@trline4.org wrote: > > Jon Elson <el...@pico-systems.com> wrote: > > >>I got a batch of "Xilinx" Spartan XCS30 FPGAs from a Chinese > >>seller, and am having problems with random failures at first > >>power up. =A0Sometimes it is a stuck I/O pin, sometimes a failure > >>to configure. =A0I first thought maybe we had an ESD problem, but > >>I'm now thinking these may be counterfeit. =A0They have white ink > >>printed labels on the front, whereas other Xilinx chips have > >>laser-etched labels. =A0Also, these Spartan chips don't have the > >>Spartan logo just below the Xilinx logo, like my other Xilinx > >>chips. =A0Anyone have any comments on this? > > > Photo.. ? > > OK, where should I put the photos? > > JonYou can send it to me,and I will pass it on. peter@xilinx.com
Reply by ●March 24, 20082008-03-24
Jon Elson <elson@wustl.edu> wrote:>sky465nm@trline4.org wrote: >> Jon Elson <elson@pico-systems.com> wrote: >> >>>I got a batch of "Xilinx" Spartan XCS30 FPGAs from a Chinese >>>seller, and am having problems with random failures at first >>>power up. Sometimes it is a stuck I/O pin, sometimes a failure >>>to configure. I first thought maybe we had an ESD problem, but >>>I'm now thinking these may be counterfeit. They have white ink >>>printed labels on the front, whereas other Xilinx chips have >>>laser-etched labels. Also, these Spartan chips don't have the >>>Spartan logo just below the Xilinx logo, like my other Xilinx >>>chips. Anyone have any comments on this? >> >> >> Photo.. ? >> >OK, where should I put the photos?Try this service: http://www.freeimagehosting.net/ (Max 3MB/picture)
Reply by ●March 25, 20082008-03-25
Peter Alfke wrote:> On Mar 24, 11:58 am, Jon Elson <el...@wustl.edu> wrote: > >>sky46...@trline4.org wrote: >> >>>Jon Elson <el...@pico-systems.com> wrote: >> >>>>I got a batch of "Xilinx" Spartan XCS30 FPGAs from a Chinese >>>>seller, and am having problems with random failures at first >>>>power up. Sometimes it is a stuck I/O pin, sometimes a failure >>>>to configure. I first thought maybe we had an ESD problem, but >>>>I'm now thinking these may be counterfeit. They have white ink >>>>printed labels on the front, whereas other Xilinx chips have >>>>laser-etched labels. Also, these Spartan chips don't have the >>>>Spartan logo just below the Xilinx logo, like my other Xilinx >>>>chips. Anyone have any comments on this? >>> >>>Photo.. ? >> >>OK, where should I put the photos? >> >>Jon > > > You can send it to me,and I will pass it on.OK, I will do that. I'll have to see how "macro" my camera will go. Do you have any comment on some date code 1999 Spartans that are printed with white ink (not laser marked) and have the Xilinx logo but no Spartan logo under it? These are XCS30-3TQ144C parts. I just got them late last year and am having what looks like a 50%+ failure rate. In the past, when I got an occasional ESD damage event, I usually observed the chip running EXTREMELY hot or totally shorting out the power supply. These chips all run cool, but many have what seems to be a stuck output pin or they don't configure at all, and the pins that should be doing certain things when the PROG/ line is cycled don't do anything. I've used several hundred of this particular Xilinx part in previous boards and never ran into any problems like this. That combined with the different markings make me think they could be counterfeit, maybe poor quality wafers that were supposed to be recycled, or something like that. Jon
Reply by ●March 25, 20082008-03-25
On Mar 25, 1:14=A0pm, Jon Elson <el...@wustl.edu> wrote:> Peter Alfke wrote: > > On Mar 24, 11:58 am, Jon Elson <el...@wustl.edu> wrote: > > >>sky46...@trline4.org wrote: > > >>>Jon Elson <el...@pico-systems.com> wrote: > > >>>>I got a batch of "Xilinx" Spartan XCS30 FPGAs from a Chinese > >>>>seller, and am having problems with random failures at first > >>>>power up. =A0Sometimes it is a stuck I/O pin, sometimes a failure > >>>>to configure. =A0I first thought maybe we had an ESD problem, but > >>>>I'm now thinking these may be counterfeit. =A0They have white ink > >>>>printed labels on the front, whereas other Xilinx chips have > >>>>laser-etched labels. =A0Also, these Spartan chips don't have the > >>>>Spartan logo just below the Xilinx logo, like my other Xilinx > >>>>chips. =A0Anyone have any comments on this? > > >>>Photo.. ? > > >>OK, where should I put the photos? > > >>Jon > > > You can send it to me,and I will pass it on. > > OK, I will do that. =A0I'll have to see how "macro" my camera will go. > Do you have any comment on some date code 1999 > Spartans that are printed with white ink (not laser marked) and > have the Xilinx logo but no Spartan logo under it? =A0These are > XCS30-3TQ144C parts. =A0I just got them late last year and am having what > looks like a 50%+ failure rate. =A0In the past, when I got an occasional > ESD damage event, I usually observed the chip running EXTREMELY hot or > totally shorting out the power supply. =A0These chips all run cool, but > many have what seems to be a stuck output pin or they don't configure at > all, and the pins that should be doing certain things when the PROG/ > line is cycled don't do anything. =A0I've used several hundred of this > particular Xilinx part in previous boards and never ran into any > problems like this. =A0That combined with the different markings make me > think they could be counterfeit, maybe poor quality wafers that were > supposed to be recycled, or something like that. > > JonJon, I really have no comments. I do not work in the Spartan group or even division, let alone building. I just promised to send your picture and comments to the people in the know. I hope the parts are fake, for I cannot imagine such a sudden surge in failure rate from good devices. Peter Alfke, who works in the Advanced Products (Virtex) division.
