Modelsim PE vs. Aldec Active-HDL (PE)

I've finally decided to buy a better simulator
(I've been making do with Modelsim XE so far).

Any thoughts as to the relative merits of Modelsim PE and
Active-HDL (PE) for FPGA simulation?

Thanks

Pete 

On Mar 3, 8:02=A0am, "Pete Fraser" <pfra...@covad.net> wrote:
> I've finally decided to buy a better simulator
> (I've been making do with Modelsim XE so far).
>
> Any thoughts as to the relative merits of Modelsim PE and
> Active-HDL (PE) for FPGA simulation?

I can't say anything about the question you asked, but I can say that
I bought the entry level design package for Lattice since they don't
have a free version that can actually be used for work like Xilinx and
Altera do.  I ordered the package that included ModelSim and that was
good for me since that is the only simulator I have used.  But between
the time I sent in the order and the time when I licensed the tool,
they changed their agreements and started providing ActiveHDL!  I
complained loudly but they would not provide a license for the tool I
had and would only send me the software for the new tool.  So I gave
it a try and have hardly looked back.

My point is that it is very easy to switch and I am totally happy with
ActiveHDL.  I can't think of anything about that I don't like other
than possibly the way it wants to create its own structure for your
files, but I finally figured out how to keep it from copying the
source files to it's own directory.  I still don't know what the
difference between a design and a "workspace" is, but the Lattice
version only allows one design to a workspace.  I don't seem to be
limited by that.

Rick

We bought Active-HDL since they are offering Mixed Language (VHDL &
Verilog) simulation at an excellent price point.

Also, the Active-HDL gui is much nicer to use (especially the waveform
viewer) than Modelsim.  Most likely since it is not TCL/TK based like
Modelsim (as far as I know).

I would vote for Active-HDL even if it was the same price as Modelsim.

On Wed, 3 Mar 2010 06:54:00 -0800 (PST)
Dave <doomeddave@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

> We bought Active-HDL since they are offering Mixed Language (VHDL &
> Verilog) simulation at an excellent price point.
> 
> Also, the Active-HDL gui is much nicer to use (especially the waveform
> viewer) than Modelsim.  Most likely since it is not TCL/TK based like
> Modelsim (as far as I know).
> 
> I would vote for Active-HDL even if it was the same price as Modelsim.
> 
> 

My experience with both has been that I prefer Active-HDL.  The GUI is
_much_ more polished; I found the ModelSim GUI to be an active
impediment to work.

In terms of the simulator itself I had serious problems (in both cases
dealing with the Xilinx libraries) with both Active-HDL, which I paid
for, and with ModelSim, which I evaled. For what it's worth I found
ModelSim's support to be more responsive.

-- 
Rob Gaddi, Highland Technology
Email address is currently out of order

>Any thoughts as to the relative merits of Modelsim PE and
>Active-HDL (PE) for FPGA simulation?
>

Have had good luck with both.  Active-HDL supports command line equivalent
of ModelSim.  One issue, the "default" format for the Active-HDL waveforms
is large and slow (??).  I think it was an extra license (cost) for the
fast format.  I don't recall which version of Active-HDL  we had but it
might be worth checking before a purchase.

Another small note, Mentor had FAE locally (CO) that was useful.  Didn't
have as good access to Aldec FAE.  But maybe I never needed to ask, so it
was needed, can't remember?  

We ran all simulations from scripts (command line) and both worked from
that perspective.

chris

	   
					
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On Mar 3, 5:02=A0am, "Pete Fraser" <pfra...@covad.net> wrote:
> I've finally decided to buy a better simulator
> (I've been making do with Modelsim XE so far).
>
> Any thoughts as to the relative merits of Modelsim PE and
> Active-HDL (PE) for FPGA simulation?
>
> Thanks
>
> Pete

One complaint I have about Active-HDL is that it insists on making a
copy of the sources and hiding them in a not so easy to find
location.  It will then simulate these, and only these copies.  If you
change a file while simulating, you have to remember to copy it out.
If you change something between simulations, you have to re-import it.

This "feature" makes the simulator mostly useful only *after* all the
bugs are fixed.  (argh)


The ModelSim windows GUI is definitely getting worse with time.  The
Linux GUI seems to be getting better though.

RK

On Mar 3, 5:42=A0pm, d_s_klein <d_s_kl...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Mar 3, 5:02=A0am, "Pete Fraser" <pfra...@covad.net> wrote:
>
> > I've finally decided to buy a better simulator
> > (I've been making do with Modelsim XE so far).
>
> > Any thoughts as to the relative merits of Modelsim PE and
> > Active-HDL (PE) for FPGA simulation?
>
> > Thanks
>
> > Pete
>
> One complaint I have about Active-HDL is that it insists on making a
> copy of the sources and hiding them in a not so easy to find
> location. =A0It will then simulate these, and only these copies. =A0If yo=
u
> change a file while simulating, you have to remember to copy it out.
> If you change something between simulations, you have to re-import it.
>
> This "feature" makes the simulator mostly useful only *after* all the
> bugs are fixed. =A0(argh)
>
> The ModelSim windows GUI is definitely getting worse with time. =A0The
> Linux GUI seems to be getting better though.
>
> RK

The copying of source files to a folder within the simulation
directory is the default, but you can override it.  The "Add Files"
dialog box has a "Make Local Copy" checkbox which once you uncheck it,
seems to stay unchecked.

My most recent issue with ActiveHDL is how to copy a project.  But I
finally figured out that "Save Design As" in the File menu does what I
want.  Just "Save As" only seems to save the waveform file.  I kept
looking under things titled "Workspace" which was not the ticket.

Rick

"d_s_klein" <d_s_klein@yahoo.com> wrote in message 
news:1f799796-32dd-4768-b66a-a935352c24f1@u19g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
On Mar 3, 5:02 am, "Pete Fraser" <pfra...@covad.net> wrote:
> I've finally decided to buy a better simulator
> (I've been making do with Modelsim XE so far).
>
>One complaint I have about Active-HDL is that it insists on making a
>copy of the sources and hiding them in a not so easy to find
>location.  It will then simulate these, and only these copies.  If you
>change a file while simulating, you have to remember to copy it out.
>If you change something between simulations, you have to re-import it.
>
>This "feature" makes the simulator mostly useful only *after* all the
>bugs are fixed.  (argh)
>
>
>The ModelSim windows GUI is definitely getting worse with time.

Yes, I found the same, however, when you install a new version of Modelsim the 
registry keys are not overwritten so to preserve your GUI settings. I found that 
deleting (or renaming) this entry fixes a lot of GUI instabilities. When you 
restart Modelsim it automatically rebuilds them.

See: HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Model Technology Incorporated\ModelSim

Hans
www.ht-lab.com

On 3 Mrz., 14:02, "Pete Fraser" <pfra...@covad.net> wrote:
> Any thoughts as to the relative merits of Modelsim PE and
> Active-HDL (PE) for FPGA simulation?

What about Systemverilog support?

To my last evaluation Aldec still lags considerably behind Mentor and
thus wasn't a option to me.

>What about Systemverilog support?
>

That might be true, does anyone know what the level of SystemVerilog
support is in Active-HDL.  Back in 2005 was using Modelsim-PE with
SystemVerilog fine, support all features I used then, class, interface,
etc.  BOMK it has been expanded since then.

You can get 30 day eval of both (pretty sure).  Might be worth trying out
unless there is a show stopper like SystemVerilog or multi-language
support, Active-HDL supports Verilog/VHDL without an extra license (i
think).	   
					
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