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Modelsim PE vs. Aldec Active-HDL (PE)

Started by Pete Fraser March 3, 2010
I've finally decided to buy a better simulator
(I've been making do with Modelsim XE so far).

Any thoughts as to the relative merits of Modelsim PE and
Active-HDL (PE) for FPGA simulation?

Thanks

Pete 


On Mar 3, 8:02=A0am, "Pete Fraser" <pfra...@covad.net> wrote:
> I've finally decided to buy a better simulator > (I've been making do with Modelsim XE so far). > > Any thoughts as to the relative merits of Modelsim PE and > Active-HDL (PE) for FPGA simulation?
I can't say anything about the question you asked, but I can say that I bought the entry level design package for Lattice since they don't have a free version that can actually be used for work like Xilinx and Altera do. I ordered the package that included ModelSim and that was good for me since that is the only simulator I have used. But between the time I sent in the order and the time when I licensed the tool, they changed their agreements and started providing ActiveHDL! I complained loudly but they would not provide a license for the tool I had and would only send me the software for the new tool. So I gave it a try and have hardly looked back. My point is that it is very easy to switch and I am totally happy with ActiveHDL. I can't think of anything about that I don't like other than possibly the way it wants to create its own structure for your files, but I finally figured out how to keep it from copying the source files to it's own directory. I still don't know what the difference between a design and a "workspace" is, but the Lattice version only allows one design to a workspace. I don't seem to be limited by that. Rick
We bought Active-HDL since they are offering Mixed Language (VHDL &
Verilog) simulation at an excellent price point.

Also, the Active-HDL gui is much nicer to use (especially the waveform
viewer) than Modelsim.  Most likely since it is not TCL/TK based like
Modelsim (as far as I know).

I would vote for Active-HDL even if it was the same price as Modelsim.


On Wed, 3 Mar 2010 06:54:00 -0800 (PST)
Dave <doomeddave@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

> We bought Active-HDL since they are offering Mixed Language (VHDL & > Verilog) simulation at an excellent price point. > > Also, the Active-HDL gui is much nicer to use (especially the waveform > viewer) than Modelsim. Most likely since it is not TCL/TK based like > Modelsim (as far as I know). > > I would vote for Active-HDL even if it was the same price as Modelsim. > >
My experience with both has been that I prefer Active-HDL. The GUI is _much_ more polished; I found the ModelSim GUI to be an active impediment to work. In terms of the simulator itself I had serious problems (in both cases dealing with the Xilinx libraries) with both Active-HDL, which I paid for, and with ModelSim, which I evaled. For what it's worth I found ModelSim's support to be more responsive. -- Rob Gaddi, Highland Technology Email address is currently out of order
>Any thoughts as to the relative merits of Modelsim PE and >Active-HDL (PE) for FPGA simulation? >
Have had good luck with both. Active-HDL supports command line equivalent of ModelSim. One issue, the "default" format for the Active-HDL waveforms is large and slow (??). I think it was an extra license (cost) for the fast format. I don't recall which version of Active-HDL we had but it might be worth checking before a purchase. Another small note, Mentor had FAE locally (CO) that was useful. Didn't have as good access to Aldec FAE. But maybe I never needed to ask, so it was needed, can't remember? We ran all simulations from scripts (command line) and both worked from that perspective. chris --------------------------------------- Posted through http://www.FPGARelated.com
On Mar 3, 5:02=A0am, "Pete Fraser" <pfra...@covad.net> wrote:
> I've finally decided to buy a better simulator > (I've been making do with Modelsim XE so far). > > Any thoughts as to the relative merits of Modelsim PE and > Active-HDL (PE) for FPGA simulation? > > Thanks > > Pete
One complaint I have about Active-HDL is that it insists on making a copy of the sources and hiding them in a not so easy to find location. It will then simulate these, and only these copies. If you change a file while simulating, you have to remember to copy it out. If you change something between simulations, you have to re-import it. This "feature" makes the simulator mostly useful only *after* all the bugs are fixed. (argh) The ModelSim windows GUI is definitely getting worse with time. The Linux GUI seems to be getting better though. RK
On Mar 3, 5:42=A0pm, d_s_klein <d_s_kl...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Mar 3, 5:02=A0am, "Pete Fraser" <pfra...@covad.net> wrote: > > > I've finally decided to buy a better simulator > > (I've been making do with Modelsim XE so far). > > > Any thoughts as to the relative merits of Modelsim PE and > > Active-HDL (PE) for FPGA simulation? > > > Thanks > > > Pete > > One complaint I have about Active-HDL is that it insists on making a > copy of the sources and hiding them in a not so easy to find > location. =A0It will then simulate these, and only these copies. =A0If yo=
u
> change a file while simulating, you have to remember to copy it out. > If you change something between simulations, you have to re-import it. > > This "feature" makes the simulator mostly useful only *after* all the > bugs are fixed. =A0(argh) > > The ModelSim windows GUI is definitely getting worse with time. =A0The > Linux GUI seems to be getting better though. > > RK
The copying of source files to a folder within the simulation directory is the default, but you can override it. The "Add Files" dialog box has a "Make Local Copy" checkbox which once you uncheck it, seems to stay unchecked. My most recent issue with ActiveHDL is how to copy a project. But I finally figured out that "Save Design As" in the File menu does what I want. Just "Save As" only seems to save the waveform file. I kept looking under things titled "Workspace" which was not the ticket. Rick
"d_s_klein" <d_s_klein@yahoo.com> wrote in message 
news:1f799796-32dd-4768-b66a-a935352c24f1@u19g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
On Mar 3, 5:02 am, "Pete Fraser" <pfra...@covad.net> wrote:
> I've finally decided to buy a better simulator > (I've been making do with Modelsim XE so far). > >One complaint I have about Active-HDL is that it insists on making a >copy of the sources and hiding them in a not so easy to find >location. It will then simulate these, and only these copies. If you >change a file while simulating, you have to remember to copy it out. >If you change something between simulations, you have to re-import it. > >This "feature" makes the simulator mostly useful only *after* all the >bugs are fixed. (argh) > > >The ModelSim windows GUI is definitely getting worse with time.
Yes, I found the same, however, when you install a new version of Modelsim the registry keys are not overwritten so to preserve your GUI settings. I found that deleting (or renaming) this entry fixes a lot of GUI instabilities. When you restart Modelsim it automatically rebuilds them. See: HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Model Technology Incorporated\ModelSim Hans www.ht-lab.com
On 3 Mrz., 14:02, "Pete Fraser" <pfra...@covad.net> wrote:
> Any thoughts as to the relative merits of Modelsim PE and > Active-HDL (PE) for FPGA simulation?
What about Systemverilog support? To my last evaluation Aldec still lags considerably behind Mentor and thus wasn't a option to me.
>What about Systemverilog support? >
That might be true, does anyone know what the level of SystemVerilog support is in Active-HDL. Back in 2005 was using Modelsim-PE with SystemVerilog fine, support all features I used then, class, interface, etc. BOMK it has been expanded since then. You can get 30 day eval of both (pretty sure). Might be worth trying out unless there is a show stopper like SystemVerilog or multi-language support, Active-HDL supports Verilog/VHDL without an extra license (i think). --------------------------------------- Posted through http://www.FPGARelated.com