> Petter Gustad <newsmailcomp6@gustad.com> wrote:
>> "Michael Polovykh" <kefir@rissa.ru> writes:
>>
>> > So you have a fridge. Put Cyclone into it during PLL work for 30minutes :)
>> > And tell us about this experiment - we are interested in it too :)
>>
>> I dubt his fridge will go as low as -20 ?C.
>
> Considering he is from .ru and its winter, he just needs to leave it outside
> overnight.
When I went to work this morning it was -18 �C (I live in Oslo,
Norway). Russia is usually a bit colder.
Petter
--
A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail?
Reply by Sander Vesik●March 2, 20052005-03-02
Petter Gustad <newsmailcomp6@gustad.com> wrote:
> "Michael Polovykh" <kefir@rissa.ru> writes:
>
> > So you have a fridge. Put Cyclone into it during PLL work for 30minutes :)
> > And tell us about this experiment - we are interested in it too :)
>
> I dubt his fridge will go as low as -20 ?C.
Considering he is from .ru and its winter, he just needs to leave it outside
overnight.
>
> Petter
--
Sander
+++ Out of cheese error +++
Reply by Jim Granville●February 22, 20052005-02-22
Alessandro Strazzero wrote:
> Dear everybody,
>
> the goal of my post is to collect your opinions about the use of Altera Cyclone
> devices in a rugged environment. I have to design a board which should control
> a chopper based on GTOs. The environment is a railway vehicle and the following
> are the conditions I have to consider:
>
> - extreme temperature range (-40�C to +85�C)
> - strong mechanical vibrations
> - long life duration (> 25 years)
> - high degree of reliability
> - very low frequency of maintenance
>
> From the point of view of the design I think Altera Cyclone is the best choise
> for this kind of project beacuse its high flexibility. But I have some doubts
> about its functionality in a rugged environment like above.
>
> Did you experience the use of Altera Cyclone in a rugged environment ?
> What are your opinions about my choise ?
You might also want to talk with Actel, as a GTO chopper is not likely
to have massive gate counts, but you WILL want fairly quick power up,
and high EMC immunity levels.
What sort of standards and guarantees do you have to meet ?
-jg
Reply by Peter Alfke●February 22, 20052005-02-22
Alessandro, there is nothing exotic about your requirements, and any
FPGA from a reputable manufacturer should meet it.
Plastic packages are very good in high-vibration environments,
25 years is a long time, but most people design for >10 years at
elevated temperature ( a description of how many years at what
temperature might help. Parts age at high temperature faster than at
cold.
High reliability is assumed today for all parts, but you might have to
pay extra for any assurance.
Low maintenance is the same as high reliability, i.e. long
mean-time-between-failure.
I do not know why you assume that Altera Cyclone fits this better than
Altera Stratix or Xilinx Spartan or Xilinx Virtex. They are all
candidates...
Peter Alfke, Xilinx Applications
Reply by ●February 22, 20052005-02-22
The PLL in the Cyclone device works down to -40 C. However the lock pin
will not correctly show the PLL-locked status if junction temp is below
-20 C AND fIN/N is 200 MHz or less. This detail is shown in the Cyclone
datasheet and is what Alex Freed is referring to. N is the divider
between the PLL input and the phase frequency detector.
You can get a lock signal one of two ways:
1. Depending on your fIN/fOUT multiplier, set up the PLL so that fIN/N
is more than 200 MHz.
2. Construct a circuit from LEs that generates a lock signal. One way
of doing this is to have a counter driven by the non-PLL clock, and
another one driven by the PLL output. (Assuming frequency is the same.)
As long as the offset between the two is not changing then the PLL is
locked. There's many possible variations of course.
Greg Steinke
Altera Corporation
Reply by Michael Polovykh●February 22, 20052005-02-22
"Petter Gustad" <newsmailcomp6@gustad.com> wrote in message
news:87oeedx1b7.fsf@filestore.home.gustad.com...
> "Michael Polovykh" <kefir@rissa.ru> writes:
>
>> "Petter Gustad" <newsmailcomp6@gustad.com> wrote in message
>> news:87zmxy871e.fsf@filestore.home.gustad.com...
>>> "Michael Polovykh" <kefir@rissa.ru> writes:
>>>
>>>> So you have a fridge. Put Cyclone into it during PLL work for 30minutes
>>>> :)
>>>> And tell us about this experiment - we are interested in it too :)
>>>
>>> I dubt his fridge will go as low as -20 �C.
>> My fridge can go down to -32�C.
>
> Impressive, my freezer wont even go that low. My fridge goes down to
> +2 �C. If I want -32 �C I will have to put it outside - on an extreme
> cold winter night...
hmm, :) and where do you store meat? i do it in refrigerating chamber of my
fridge. ;)
>
> Petter
> --
> A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
> Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
> A: Top-posting.
> Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail?
Reply by ●February 21, 20052005-02-21
"Michael Polovykh" <kefir@rissa.ru> writes:
> "Petter Gustad" <newsmailcomp6@gustad.com> wrote in message
> news:87zmxy871e.fsf@filestore.home.gustad.com...
>> "Michael Polovykh" <kefir@rissa.ru> writes:
>>
>>> So you have a fridge. Put Cyclone into it during PLL work for 30minutes
>>> :)
>>> And tell us about this experiment - we are interested in it too :)
>>
>> I dubt his fridge will go as low as -20 �C.
> My fridge can go down to -32�C.
Impressive, my freezer wont even go that low. My fridge goes down to
+2 �C. If I want -32 �C I will have to put it outside - on an extreme
cold winter night...
Petter
--
A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail?
Reply by Michael Polovykh●February 21, 20052005-02-21
"Petter Gustad" <newsmailcomp6@gustad.com> wrote in message
news:87zmxy871e.fsf@filestore.home.gustad.com...
> "Michael Polovykh" <kefir@rissa.ru> writes:
>
>> So you have a fridge. Put Cyclone into it during PLL work for 30minutes
>> :)
>> And tell us about this experiment - we are interested in it too :)
>
> I dubt his fridge will go as low as -20 �C.
My fridge can go down to -32�C.
>
> Petter
> --
> A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
> Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
> A: Top-posting.
> Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail?
Reply by Michael Polovykh●February 21, 20052005-02-21
"Alex Freed" <alexf@mirrow.com> wrote in message
news:RrydnSnopcJE4YXfRVn-hw@comcast.com...
>I have heared roumors that the PLL in Cyclone doesn't work below -20C if
>the
> output frequency is higher than the input. There is some fine print in the
> datasheet to that effect.
>
> Now I have no way of knowing if that is true or not - I live in California
> :))
So you have a fridge. Put Cyclone into it during PLL work for 30minutes :)
And tell us about this experiment - we are interested in it too :)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
>
> "Alessandro Strazzero" <alessandro.strazzero@virgilio.it> wrote in message
> news:391fed46.0502180459.5ad267fb@posting.google.com...
>> Dear everybody,
>>
>> the goal of my post is to collect your opinions about the use of Altera
> Cyclone
>> devices in a rugged environment. I have to design a board which should
> control
>> a chopper based on GTOs. The environment is a railway vehicle and the
> following
>> are the conditions I have to consider:
>>
>> - extreme temperature range (-40�C to +85�C)
>> - strong mechanical vibrations
>> - long life duration (> 25 years)
>> - high degree of reliability
>> - very low frequency of maintenance
>>
>> From the point of view of the design I think Altera Cyclone is the best
> choise
>> for this kind of project beacuse its high flexibility. But I have some
> doubts
>> about its functionality in a rugged environment like above.
>>
>> Did you experience the use of Altera Cyclone in a rugged environment ?
>> What are your opinions about my choise ?
>>
>> Best Regards
>>
>> /Alessandro Strazzero
>
>
Reply by ●February 21, 20052005-02-21
"Michael Polovykh" <kefir@rissa.ru> writes:
> So you have a fridge. Put Cyclone into it during PLL work for 30minutes :)
> And tell us about this experiment - we are interested in it too :)
I dubt his fridge will go as low as -20 �C.
Petter
--
A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail?