As far as I could discover, this is still a propriatary device, and therefore you could not use a standard SPI flash instead. If no competition (read pin/pin compatible replacement) is possible, Altera could keep up the price as high as they want. With standard SPI flash, I have the choice of at least 5 different suppliers, no potentialy delivery problems, and guaranteed lowest price. Thus driving the total solution cost to a minimum. Luc On Tue, 13 Jul 2004 20:52:44 +0100, "Leon Heller" <leon_heller@hotmail.com> wrote:>"Andy Peters" <Bassman59a@yahoo.com> wrote in message >news:9a2c3a75.0407131029.137e7596@posting.google.com... >> paul_sereno@hotmail.com (Paul Sereno) wrote in message >news:<3d7510b4.0407021019.c3a5df5@posting.google.com>... >> > I am just wandering if any of you have take a look at the Lattice >> > FPGAs. I do like the DSP functions. >> > is out there any serious comparation against SpartanIII and Cyclone? >> >> The local Lattice FAE gave us the low-down. Looks like a decent set >> of chips. >> >> One thing we REALLY liked is that if you go with the devices that use >> an external configuration EPROM (rather than the family with the >> internal config flash), you can use a standard (read: CHEAP) SPI >> device, rather than a non-cheap specific config chip. >> >> I've always wondered why Brand A and Brand X continue to use their >> expensive config parts. Actually, that's not true -- I know why. >> Seriously, what's the point of using a $10 FPGA when the config EPROM >> is also $10? > >Altera has addressed this problem with the Cyclone family - the >configuration devices are quite cheap. > >Leon >
new Lattice FPGAs vs Cyclone and SpartanIII
Started by ●July 2, 2004
Reply by ●July 13, 20042004-07-13
Reply by ●July 14, 20042004-07-14
Luc Braeckman wrote:> As far as I could discover, this is still a propriatary device, and > therefore you could not use a standard SPI flash instead. If no > competition (read pin/pin compatible replacement) is possible, Altera > could keep up the price as high as they want. > With standard SPI flash, I have the choice of at least 5 different > suppliers, no potentialy delivery problems, and guaranteed lowest > price. Thus driving the total solution cost to a minimum. > > LucStill unverified by me, but someone pointed here some time ago that EPCS devices are indeed a standard device produced by ST (M25Px0). Anyway, if that's true, Altera has a quite expensive paint... :D Ricardo
Reply by ●July 14, 20042004-07-14
I suppose you could use an SPI flash in conjuction with a cheap up like a PIC (some of those are less than a dollar, and they even have one in a SOT23 package) to undercut the cost of the serial config ROMs. -- --Ray Andraka, P.E. President, the Andraka Consulting Group, Inc. 401/884-7930 Fax 401/884-7950 email ray@andraka.com http://www.andraka.com "They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -Benjamin Franklin, 1759
Reply by ●July 14, 20042004-07-14
Just FYI, there is an application note on this very topic that demonstrates how to configure a Xilinx FPGA from an SPI serial Flash using a small CPLD. The application note is written for CoolRunner-II, but practically any Xilinx CPLD will do. XAPP800: Configuring Xilinx FPGAs with SPI Flash Memories Using CoolRunner-II CPLDs http://www.xilinx.com/bvdocs/appnotes/xapp800.pdf While we're on the subject, have you ever wanted to store additional information in the configuration memory (serial numbers, Ethernet MAC IDs, MicroBlaze code) and read it after the FPGA configures? If so, the following application note may be of interest. XAPP694: Reading User Data from Configuration PROMs http://www.xilinx.com/bvdocs/appnotes/xapp694.pdf The two demo designs for the Spartan-3 Starter Kit also demonstrate this capability. http://www.xilinx.com/products/spartan3/s3boards.htm#RF --------------------------------- Steven K. Knapp Applications Manager, Xilinx Inc. General Products Division Spartan-3/II/IIE FPGAs http://www.xilinx.com/spartan3 --------------------------------- Spartan-3: Make it Your ASIC "Ray Andraka" <ray@andraka.com> wrote in message news:40F5AEB8.DDDC48C9@andraka.com...> I suppose you could use an SPI flash in conjuction with a cheap up like aPIC (some of those are less than a dollar,> and they even have one in a SOT23 package) to undercut the cost of theserial config ROMs.> > > -- > --Ray Andraka, P.E. > President, the Andraka Consulting Group, Inc. > 401/884-7930 Fax 401/884-7950 > email ray@andraka.com > http://www.andraka.com > > "They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little > temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." > -Benjamin Franklin, 1759 > >
Reply by ●July 15, 20042004-07-15
Of course you can, why not building a complete system just to configure the FPGA (sic). The idea of a cheap SPI flash directly connected to the FPGA is very attractive, especially in consumer application where every cent counts. Regards, Luc ___ On Wed, 14 Jul 2004 17:28:59 -0700, "Steven K. Knapp" <steve.knappNO#SPAM@xilinx.com> wrote:>Just FYI, there is an application note on this very topic that demonstrates >how to configure a Xilinx FPGA from an SPI serial Flash using a small CPLD. >The application note is written for CoolRunner-II, but practically any >Xilinx CPLD will do. > >XAPP800: Configuring Xilinx FPGAs with SPI Flash Memories Using >CoolRunner-II CPLDs >http://www.xilinx.com/bvdocs/appnotes/xapp800.pdf > >While we're on the subject, have you ever wanted to store additional >information in the configuration memory (serial numbers, Ethernet MAC IDs, >MicroBlaze code) and read it after the FPGA configures? If so, the >following application note may be of interest. > >XAPP694: Reading User Data from Configuration PROMs >http://www.xilinx.com/bvdocs/appnotes/xapp694.pdf > >The two demo designs for the Spartan-3 Starter Kit also demonstrate this >capability. >http://www.xilinx.com/products/spartan3/s3boards.htm#RF > >--------------------------------- >Steven K. Knapp >Applications Manager, Xilinx Inc. >General Products Division >Spartan-3/II/IIE FPGAs >http://www.xilinx.com/spartan3 >--------------------------------- >Spartan-3: Make it Your ASIC > > >"Ray Andraka" <ray@andraka.com> wrote in message >news:40F5AEB8.DDDC48C9@andraka.com... >> I suppose you could use an SPI flash in conjuction with a cheap up like a >PIC (some of those are less than a dollar, >> and they even have one in a SOT23 package) to undercut the cost of the >serial config ROMs. >> >> >> -- >> --Ray Andraka, P.E. >> President, the Andraka Consulting Group, Inc. >> 401/884-7930 Fax 401/884-7950 >> email ray@andraka.com >> http://www.andraka.com >> >> "They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little >> temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." >> -Benjamin Franklin, 1759 >> >> > >
Reply by ●July 15, 20042004-07-15
"Steven K. Knapp" <steve.knappNO#SPAM@xilinx.com> wrote in message news:<cd4j4e$oeu6@cliff.xsj.xilinx.com>...> Just FYI, there is an application note on this very topic that demonstrates > how to configure a Xilinx FPGA from an SPI serial Flash using a small CPLD. > The application note is written for CoolRunner-II, but practically any > Xilinx CPLD will do. > > XAPP800: Configuring Xilinx FPGAs with SPI Flash Memories Using > CoolRunner-II CPLDs > http://www.xilinx.com/bvdocs/appnotes/xapp800.pdfYeah, but this solution still requires another part. Perhaps reasonable if you needed the CPLD for other things, but otherwise it's not a very good solution. Some boards are overstuffed as it is! I remember using a 9536 to interface a parallel EPROM to XC4000-series parts, but that was ages ago, before the G-dsend known as in-system JTAG-programmable parts ... --a
